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Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws

Pages: 1 [2]

topic icon Author Topic: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws  (Read 597 times)

Downunder Dan

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #25 on: September 14, 2024, 12:11:03 AM »

The Iron Men. Essentially the Kelly Gang story stripped down and relocated to Texas.

I laughed out loud when the telegraph operator at the start is trying to send an emergency message when the armoured man is an arm's length away. Skilled Morse operators are quick, but this looked like the operator overestimated his ability.

There's a touch of the man in the iron mask here, with Captain McNelly luckily having the prototype armour hanging up on his wall. (McNelly looks like a reference to Ned Kelly...)

It's a simply told version of the story, but lacking any real tension. The art is clear and well-rendered, and the cover of the comic probably sold some extra comics by looking different.
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The Australian Panther

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #26 on: September 14, 2024, 01:42:59 AM »

 The Kelly Gang Rides
https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=95755

I'm going to restrict my remarks to the Ned Kelly story.
I enjoyed it - it's fairly accurate as to the events it showcases but sticks to the standard interpretations of those events.
Dan wrote,
One great comics adaptation of the Ned Kelly story was published in the 1970s as a newspaper strip. It's written and drawn by the late Monty Wedd,
The Wikipedia article on Wedd is incomplete.
He had a determination to use comics for non-fiction subjects and had already published a number of these in a non- comic standard format. Larger and on card-like paper. I remember reading them in my school library.
Later he did comic strips on Ned Kelly and also Ben Hall.
Kelly's story, like many of these types of characters is not black and white but rather various shades of grey.
Speaking metaphorically.
Quote
The Firesign Theatre - 'Everything You Know Is Wrong'
 

Scrounge said
Quote
Hmm, I thought the Kelly gang used the armor in more than just in their final battle.
Nope!
Dan said
Quote
I was visiting Melbourne about 7 years ago, and I came face-to-lack-of-face with Ned Kelly's Armour. It looks like this:

Note the three bullet indentations.One in the head, one in the neck on the right side and one mid-torso.
Morgus said,
Quote
Now you see, I lost interest in the Ned Kelly story right away after I got a look at him. NOT accurate. Everybody KNOWS he looks like Mick Jagger.

In 2003 Heath Ledger played the role. John Jarret played the role in the mini-series 'The last outlaw'.
Nearly as many versions in various media as Jesse James or Dick Turpin to name two. 
Characters in armor?
Robots?
The Golden age Robotman, Robot Archie.
Man in Armour?
DC's John Henry [Steel] and his Daughter [woman in armour], Batman armored up to defeat Superman. 
Man in the iron mask? can't think of other characters whose identity is captive to whoever made him wear a mask.
Half-man, half machine? [Cyborg] Doom Patrol Robotman, Marvel's first cyborg,Deathlock, Hank Henshaw the cyborg Superman.
Many others.   


« Last Edit: September 14, 2024, 02:46:42 AM by The Australian Panther »
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The Australian Panther

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2024, 03:45:44 AM »

T.H.U.N.D.E.R. Agents 1
https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=64781
Quote
I found [comics] in a city 20 miles away and in a department store of all places. There was a comics rack hidden in the back of the store.
Been there, done that. Brings back memories!
Dynamo for some reason puts me in mind of [Fawcetts] Captain Marvel.
Also, ever thought about how many superheroes have names that are either Thunder or Lightning or variants?
The Thunder Agents were an interesting group of characters which somehow never reached their full potential.
Art, by a group of golden age greats, was always superior, as were some of the ideas, but the writing was not up to the standard of the competition, mainly Marvel. 
Len is a paper pusher but the council, who sit high above and at a distance like Judges, say,
'We've watched you closely and found that you possess the qualities that THUNDER seeks in its members'
How?
Just how can an electromagnet life Fog?
It would be easy to tear the book apart by analyzing details, but the strength of the art works to concentrate your attention on the narrative.
Warlord and Iron Maiden just turn up with no backstory, and I don't think 'Rusty' (Who isn't) ever had a backstory.
Always loved the NOMAN character, but there is huge unued potential there. 
The splash page for the MENTHOR character looks like Gil Kane but the rest of the story is Andru and  Esopoito. Another interesting idea with unused potential.
The SQUAD is an interesting idea, with WEED the most interesting character.
In this case, Rusty is the one in armor, but she is just sketched in, why is she wearing armor?
Why is she working for WARLORD. And in their first meeting there is no chemistry between her and Len.
Good start to the series though.
And yeah, just how does she get into that armor?   
               
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The Australian Panther

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2024, 04:40:03 AM »

Dead-Eye Western v1 11
https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=17399

great cover.
The Arkansas Toothpick
Never been a Gerald McCann fan, but this work is the best I have ever seen from him.
The Iron Men
Good art, but who?
Not much to say about the story. They don't do much with the armor.
 
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The Australian Panther

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2024, 05:00:27 AM »

Spy Smasher 4
https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=40234
Story 2 - Man in the iron mask.
Dan said,
Quote
But this story is actually a Phantom of the Opera story. That's where most of the story beats come from - well, other than the brief dip into the Pit and the Pendulum. It does that quite well. 
Exactly. Leaves me with little to say. Great mash-up!
Excellent visual pacing with the art. Nice ending. Since they don't try to find his body in the moat, you know he'll be back!
Need to read me some more Spy Smasher.
thanks Dan, and I'll see you all on Monday 


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Robb_K

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #30 on: September 14, 2024, 06:46:58 AM »

The Kelly Gang Rides
The first thing I noticed as a reader of some Australian comic books during the 1950s, was that 6d (sixpence) got you comic books woith from 24 to 36 pages.  So, getting 50 pages of comics for 6d looks like a great bargain.  I think it is interesting that a non-fiction portrayal of an historical account is paired with a clone of the incredibly fictional "Tarzan of The Apes"/meets "Turok Son of Stone".

(1) The Kelly Gang Rides
The artwork is a bit rough and the figures a bit amateurish-looking in places, but it has its own style and charm. I enjoyed reading the basic details of The Kelly Gang's story, and how they were treated as the family of a former deported prisoner, several of whom who themselves became prisoners due to less chances to earn an honest living, and/or brushes with the law due to maltreatment from prejudice.  It must have been terrible to be deported from one's homeland to be housed in a penal colony, and then being effectively "forced" to reside there for the rest of one's life, in a non-helpful atmosphere in which his stigma follows him everywhere. 

Having lived in North Africa and The Middle East for 15 + years the idea of wearing armour made of iron in Australia, in summer would be my idea of going to Hell.  I've often wondered how many of The European Crusaders sweated out ALL of their water, and died of heat stroke from wearing their armour in summer battles for the castles bordering the fringes of The Syrian Desert and the start of the adjoining steppeland, in present day Eastern Jordan and Syria.  Before finding out that The Kelly's met their doom in Victoria, I imagined them wearing that armour in The Outback, and dying of heat prostration before the police's bullets hit them.  As Victoria can get fairly hot in summer, I wonder what time of year the depicted battle occurred. 
The only place in Australia I'd even consider trying iron armour on outside of a refrigerated room would be in Tasmania, or The Australian Alps (and even in those places, not in summer.

I'm shocked to see that The Victoria Police's uniforms look like 19th Century French military uniforms, and 19th and 20th Century French Police Gendarmes' uniforms, and also with the moustaches and beards that went along with them.  As I read, I kept looking for the soldiers' dialogue balloons to be filled with the English stereotypes of Frenchmen speaking English with a French accent.

I think that criminals capturing the personnel of a ranch (station), only to "steal" (kidnap) their cook is hilarious! 

Don't you all think that the desperate criminals stealing old ploughshares and melting them down to form into battle armour is ironic, in view of The Bible's phrase regarding the beating of weapons of war into ploughshares after World Peace is finally reached?
Like Scrounge, I too, am new to the Australian idiom, "Bail up!".  It's clear from context that it means "Raus!", 'Move it!"  "Get movin'! "Get a move on!"  I wonder if that idiomatic phrase came from tying (bailing) up the filled bags of sheep's wool in the Australian regional sheep shearing events?

I found this balloon of a soldier's speech not very understandable: "You old she,..I'll give you hit me with a shovel!"  I know what he means, but it sounds awkward to a 20th Century Canadian ear.
I'd have written, "You old witch (or Crone)!  "I'll give YOU the backside of a shovel!"

Dan's retort of "LIKE SMOKE!" to the Sergeant's order for him to come along is also a new one on me.  But it is clear that it means "Like HELL I will!"  or "Over my dead body!"

The term "Blacktrackers" is clear that it means Aboiriginal trackers, who can use their fantastic skills and knowledge of tracking animals on following the tracks of humans.  I can't remember hearing that term except perhaps hearing it in an aussie film, and not thinking twice about it because it explains itself.  And I might have reacted to it similarly in reading a book of Australian origin.

I'm glasd that the train full of passengers was saved by the alert schoolteacher, who through his set-up diversion, escaped to warn the driver, and stop the train. 

I would have covered my legs with armour, as well, IF I were in the criminals' situation, but I also would have realised that the path would end with most of my family dying, and the few that would have lived would have spent the rest of their lives in prison.  So, I doubt if I'd have done what The Kelly's did, even if it meant being mistreated by the police for my father's crimes.

I would guess that this version was reasonably close to what really happened.  It was entertaining enough, and held my interest enough, asd I'm always interested in learning more history.

(2) Thunder, King Of The Gorilla Empire
The artwork inb this story is much better.  But it is awfully fanciful, having a 7 foot 6 inch man being just as strong as unnaturally large gorillas that must each weigh over 1,000 pounds, given that we know that normal  mountain gorillas of 600 pounds are pound-for-pound several times stronger than humans.  A 7 foot 6 man would not be normal, unless he were a Dinka from South Sudan.  He'd likely be a victim of growth-hormone imbalance, which,m already in a victim's early 20s, would make his body movements very uncoordinated, and he would already suffer pain in his joints, and need to rest them often from over work.  That doesn't sound like he would be able to be "as strong as any of those super-large, super-strong gorillas", and be able to lead them in battle against gigantic pre-historic animals.  Again we have the long-time fantasy story of a remote, hidden place on Earth that was able to keep it's ancient climate so that very, very, very ancient animals could remain living there millions of years after they went extinct in all other parts of The Earth.  Let's say thgat we accept that explanation for the Jurassic and Cretaceous Period's tropical animals remaining alive....How is it then that the Wooly Mammoths of The Pleistocene Period's Ice Ages were also able to live there?  Having grown up with a Husky and a Malamut, who were very comfortable in Manitoba's subarctic winters, but suffered greatly in our short, but hot summers, I somehow doubt that Wooly Mammoths(a seasonally migrating animal), with all that hair, would migrate into a steamy tropical jungle, and just remain there.  They are an open tundra animal, as opposed to a thick forest animal in any case.  And don't get me started on the Gorilla "Tribe" speaking Australian English (or The King's English).  The author should have placed and asterisk on both Thunder's first dialogue ballon, and that of the first Gorilla speaker, and the footnote should have read "Gorilla language" translated for the convenience of thge reader."  And even IF Thunder COULD have successfully learned to communicate with The Gorillas, would they REALLy have understood a speech by him with so many words and abstract concepts as he told them on the story's opening splash page?  Chimpanzees, who we have found are MORE intelligent  (in Mankind's current terms) than Gorillas, but can only understand about 200 concrete concepts; NONE of them being abstract.   Thgis is like Science Fantasy, as opposed tob Science Fiction.  There are way too many holes for a person with a science background and logical thinking to suspend belief and enjoy the attempt at "entertainment" for what it is.

Not to mention that we have the old European "White Supremacy" ideal of the hero that looks like me becoming the leader of a non-European country or tribe because he  or she is wiser and physically or morally stronger, and that came from his underlings, willingly, because they understand he is much more fit to do so than any of them.

A giant Ground Sloth large enough to win a battle with a Diplodicus????  That's almost as silly as a mouse named mickey, talking, walking upright, and weary clothing and fighting Nazis.

(3) Blitzie Bessie The Cow
The artwork is decent.  The comedy is neither clever, nor funny.  It wouldn't even have made it on The Vaudeville stage.

(4) Dicky Lea The Flea
Worse than the cow gag!  Waste of a page.

Overall Assessment
One comic book containing a non-fiction account of a true-life past event, paired with a very fanciful combination of "Tarzan" and "The Lost World".  This is about the strangest cobination of stories in any comic book I can remember.  In any case, it was entertaing and I enjoyed reading the book.  The nice artwork saved the second story for me.
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Quirky Quokka

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #31 on: September 14, 2024, 07:36:35 AM »

Robb said:

Quote
(1) The Kelly Gang Rides

Having lived in North Africa and The Middle East for 15 + years the idea of wearing armour made of iron in Australia, in summer would be my idea of going to Hell.  I've often wondered how many of The European Crusaders sweated out ALL of their water, and died of heat stroke from wearing their armour in summer battles for the castles bordering the fringes of The Syrian Desert and the start of the adjoining steppeland, in present day Eastern Jordan and Syria.  Before finding out that The Kelly's met their doom in Victoria, I imagined them wearing that armour in The Outback, and dying of heat prostration before the police's bullets hit them.  As Victoria can get fairly hot in summer, I wonder what time of year the depicted battle occurred.
The only place in Australia I'd even consider trying iron armour on outside of a refrigerated room would be in Tasmania, or The Australian Alps (and even in those places, not in summer.


Hi Robb, I had to look it up. The final siege at Glenrowan took place in June, which is winter in Australia, and Glenrowan isn't far from the Australian Alps which do get snow in winter, so it would have been cooler. But yes, you would sweat in that armour in summer for sure. Victoria can also get very hot.

Quote
Don't you all think that the desperate criminals stealing old ploughshares and melting them down to form into battle armour is ironic, in view of The Bible's phrase regarding the beating of weapons of war into ploughshares after World Peace is finally reached?


Yes, I did think of that quote when I heard the word 'ploughshares'. Ironic. Also, it would not have been an easy job for a blacksmith to shape those ploughshares into armour. Quite a feat in itself.

Quote
The term "Blacktrackers" is clear that it means Aboiriginal trackers, who can use their fantastic skills and knowledge of tracking animals on following the tracks of humans.  I can't remember hearing that term except perhaps hearing it in an aussie film, and not thinking twice about it because it explains itself.  And I might have reacted to it similarly in reading a book of Australian origin.


I can't remember if I've heard them called blacktrackers, but aboriginal trackers were greatly valued for their abilities. They were used by European settlers in exploring the country and often used by police to catch criminals, find missing persons, or sometimes (sadly) to track down aboriginal people who'd run away from missions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aboriginal_tracker

Quote
I would guess that this version was reasonably close to what really happened.  It was entertaining enough, and held my interest enough, and I'm always interested in learning more history.


It does seem to follow the main points, though it's hard to tell the timeline (I think it all happened over a period of about 2 years) and it doesn't give much backstory about why the Kellys did what they did. But a reasonably good portrayal from what I can tell.

Cheers

QQ
« Last Edit: September 14, 2024, 07:39:53 AM by Quirky Quokka »
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The Australian Panther

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #32 on: September 14, 2024, 07:42:32 AM »

Robb said,

Quote
  It must have been terrible to be deported from one's homeland to be housed in a penal colony, 

Ned's father had been a criminal, a horse thief in Ireland. ( which I understand would have gotten him killed in North America) but Victoria wasn't a penal colony. Not all the Australian states were.
The reason why Britain sent convicts to settle Australia was because the American war of independence meant that they could no longer send them to the US which up to that point, they had been doing.
And when freed most were happy to stay in Australia as the opportunities were generally much greater that they would be if they returned home. They were certainly not forced to stay in Australia.
However, many of the Irish in Australia had no love for those of British Origin and vice versa - Particularly in that part of Australia. That's the context for the Ned Kelly story. There is a lot more to it. 
Quote
I would have covered my legs with armour, as well, IF I were in the criminals' situation, but I also would have realised that the path would end with most of my family dying, and the few that would have lived would have spent the rest of their lives in prison.  So, I doubt if I'd have done what The Kelly's did, even if it meant being mistreated by the police for my father's crimes. 

Ned's family had already been mistrated by the troopers but We are talking about Australia, under British law, not Russia or the middle east. Anyway, that never happened.         

Quote
Like Scrounge, I too, am new to the Australian idiom, "Bail up!".  It's clear from context that it means "Raus!", 'Move it!"  "Get movin'! "Get a move on!"  I wonder if that idiomatic phrase came from tying (bailing) up the filled bags of sheep's wool in the Australian regional sheep shearing events? 

Actually it has exactly the opposite meaning.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/bail--up

verb

    informal.
    to confine (a cow) or (of a cow) to be confined by the head in a bail See bail 3
    tr history (of a bushranger) to hold under guard in order to rob
    intr to submit to robbery without offering resistance
    informal.
    tr to accost or detain, esp in conversation; buttonhole.

Quote
I found this balloon of a soldier's speech not very understandable

A trooper in those times was a policeman, not a soldier.
Quote
  I imagined them wearing that Armour in The Outback, and dying of heat prostration before the police's bullets hit them. 

They only wore the Armour during the fight and only once because they were anticipating a major battle.
The 'special' train, which they had advance warning of, was filled with heavily armed 'troopers'

To be fair, there would be many younger generation Australians who would not know these things.   
« Last Edit: September 14, 2024, 08:12:05 AM by The Australian Panther »
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Quirky Quokka

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #33 on: September 14, 2024, 07:56:07 AM »

Dead-Eye Western - The Ironmen

Yes, definitely some 'borrowing' from Ned Kelly in this story. As an Australian, I feel obliged to sue the pants off them. My lawyer will be in touch  ;)

From the very first panel, you can see that there are quite a lot of gaps in that armour, so it was funny when they thought they were invincible. A sharpshooter should be able to get to some of those un-armoured spots pretty easily. And as Dan said, it was lucky that a copy of the armour just happened to be hanging up in the Texas Ranger's office.

They spared showing us the Ironmen hanging from the scaffold and just told us what would happen. They obviously hadn't bought the toy scaffold that was advertised in The THUNDER agents book  :D Another case of crime doesn't pay.

The art was good and the story was okay, though westerns aren't my favourite genre. I didn't enjoy this one as much as some of the other books.

Spy Smasher

This is the first Spy Smasher story I've read, and I enjoyed it overall.

As others have said, it has overtones of Phantom of the Opera. But when he first started playing the organ in the secret room, I couldn't help thinking of the Don Knotts' classic 'The Ghost and Mr Chicken'. I loved that movie as a kid. So scary!  OOOhhhh!!!!! Here's the trailer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzZ0XO4ly1g

On p. 28, we learn that Eve alone knows that Alan is Spy Smasher. Does Alan know she knows? Though it seems ludicrous that her father can't work it out. Not too savvy for an admiral (p. 27).

Some good art and interesting angles (e.g., p. 30). I also thought Eve was well-drawn for the most part.

An entertaining story overall. I would probably read more of these.

Cheers

QQ


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Robb_K

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #34 on: September 14, 2024, 09:09:58 AM »


Robb said,


Quote
Like Scrounge, I too, am new to the Australian idiom, "Bail up!".  It's clear from context that it means "Raus!", 'Move it!"  "Get movin'! "Get a move on!"  I wonder if that idiomatic phrase came from tying (bailing) up the filled bags of sheep's wool in the Australian regional sheep shearing events? 

Actually it has exactly the opposite meaning.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/bail--up

verb

    informal.
    to confine (a cow) or (of a cow) to be confined by the head in a bail See bail 3
    tr history (of a bushranger) to hold under guard in order to rob
    intr to submit to robbery without offering resistance
    informal.
    tr to accost or detain, esp in conversation; buttonhole.


So it meant to tie oneself up - e.g. to keep one's self from taking action, by avoiding taking action, to be complacent, and let the robbers rob you.  THAT still could have come from tying the wool bags tight, because it's confining the wool in a smaller area.
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Robb_K

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #35 on: September 14, 2024, 10:06:18 PM »

Dead-Eye Western Vol. 1 No. 11 - The Ironmen
This book is blessed with excellent artwork.  And the stories are very good, as well.

(1) The Arkansas Toothpick
A very inventive story, based on a universally-known truth, that bullies are generally cowards, and the biggest mouth should keep closed, lest the owner will put his foot in side it.was there ever a lawman who had THAT much faith in his judgement???  I'm not so sure I would bet on that.  Really unexpected ending, that replacing oft-used specially-made throwing knives with kitchen knives would be so different in feel and aerodynamics as to make the thrower's throws miss his target by so much that enough of them would land in a bystander to kill him.  And with lots of witnesses around, the thrower would be easily convicted for murder!  Would the thrower continue to throw the same way (without adjusting his aim, after seeing how far off his mark his first throw went???  The whole story is quite unbelivable.  But, being so inventive, it holds the reader's interest to see an expected unexpected ending.  And the reader is far from being disappointed.

(2) The Ironmen (Seemingly based on The Kelly's story)
Clearly, this story, allegedly taking place in Texas, was inspired by the true events of The Kelly Gang's demise in Australia, during the previous century.  Even the armour was likely patterned after a photo of The Kelly's iron coverings.  This story has the same weakness, in that the armour leaves vital areas uncovered, that makes the criminals vulnerable to multiple wounds from sharpshooters.

This story has an unbelivable logic error, that the heavy iron armour would slow down the criminal gang's 1000 + pound horses enough to read in their tracks, and yet there is no sign to the reader that such heavy armour would impede the movement of its many times smaller and weaker Human armour wearers!  That seems an utterly ridiculous unnecessary story point to attempt to make, and so, a grievous logic error made by the writer.

The idea that the criminals cut telegraph wires BEFORE committing their crime, so the police can't be notified in time to intercept the purpetrators, or find the culprits after they've started their getaway, as the police would only find out about the crime AFTER the gang could easily have ridden out of their jurisdiction, and could scatter with their individual cuts of the swag with ample time to backtrack and confuse their trails.

However, the gang is shown locking the local Federal Marshal, WITHOUT wearing a mask.  So he can later be identified, and captured due to reports of where he's been seen.  It is a grievous error on the writer's or artists' part.

The Federal Territorial Police troops are taking sa train to where The Gang is expected to be, similar to the situation leading to the climax in The Kelly Gang's story.  In this story, the criminals tear up the train tracks, rather than the railroad's own track-layers, in The Kelly's story.  In this story, the telegraph operator was shot by the criminals, but they erred in not finishing the job and making sure he was dead.  So, having been shot only in his shoulder, he was able to run up into the hills to warn the train driver to stop.   In this story, the gang is in the nearby railroad station house, which is set on fire (analogus to The Kelly's being holed up inside a ranch house, which gets set on fire).

(3) The Slayer of The Grizzlies
It starts off with something seemingly unnatural.  Horses are not normally hunted or eaten by bears, nor are they known to be mortal enemies.  Why would a grizzly bear attack penned up horses on a ranch, and kill one?
The only reason a bear would kill a tamed horse would be if the former were starving.  Yet, the story doesn't show that the bear ate even a bite from the horse's carcass.  Yet, the rancher mentions that the bear has "the blood scent", and so will be back to kill more horses.  So the horse rancher must track the bear into the mountains to kill it, to save his herd.  The greenhorn rancher (ex city-slicker) from Boston, manages (through luck) to avoid being killed by the bear, and manages to shoot it and it falls off a cliff to its death.  He is proclaimed by the local Blackfeet Tribe to be a "Mighty Hunter".  And he becomes a hero to the local "White Men".  This all goes to his head, and he decides to earn his living by hunting wild animals.  The ex-rancher becomes a famous hunter of grizzlie bears, caused by hatred of them because one of those he hunted killed his favourite horse.  He became a bounty hunter killing Grizzlies who were attacking, killing and eating farm animals.  Very much the same plot all through. No twists. Nothing unexpected.  Fairly boring.  But, good art saves it to some extent.

(4) Better Schools Make Better Communities
Fulfills the "worthwhile content" requirement to get the lower 2nd Class  Postage Rate.

(5) The Outlaws Kid
A moral tale that is very true to life, and most of us probably have wrestled with doing right or wrong at one time or another in our lives.  This has a similar thread to The Kelly Gang's story, in that the son of a criminal father is treated like a criminal for no reason.  And he makes the mistake of turning to crime, thinking he'll have no other way to survive.  But in this story, thge still youthful young man can't get away from the promise he made to his father to grow up to become a law-abiding citizen and avoid the mistakes his father made.  So, in the end, he gives himself up to then police, willing to serve his short prison sentence for armed robbery, with no one being hurt.  And the reader knows he will live the rest of his life as a law-abiding good citizen.

(6) The Best Horseman in Ohio - (The Story of Ulysses S. Grant's military career)
This was mainly just describing a few events in his long career that made him famous and led to his being elected President of The USA.  It would have sufficed to fill "The Worthwhile Content" requirement, even without having the public service page on the importance of parents being involved in their communities school systems.

(7) The Man Who Didn't Know Indians
This should have been titled "The Man Who Got Half A Wagon Train's People Killed To Feed His Ego".  He refused to take the advice of The US Military leader, and led his wagon train into an area where The various Native American Sioux tribes were in uprising against the intruding American settlers.  The result was that he learned to listen to advice of people who knew their subject better.  Luckily for him, The US Army offerred him a job as a Scout.  Unlucky for the families who lost loved ones.  I suspect this story was based on a true life incident.

This book was an enbtertaining read, with good artwork throughout, and interesting stories. 
« Last Edit: September 14, 2024, 11:16:23 PM by Robb_K »
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Downunder Dan

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #36 on: September 15, 2024, 11:55:37 AM »

Dynamo, The Iron Mist.

The story is a little overburdened with introducing THUNDER as an organisation and then telling the first assignment of Dynamo against the army of the Warlord. Possibly some of that detail could have given in the first story in the book, First Encounter, although it is probably neater to show how Dynamo, NoMan and Menthor assumed their roles. May also have been in anticipation of future sales, making stories of each character able to be standalone.

The story is told at a fairly high-level, with narration being detached and omniscient and relying on the art to provide the active dynamism and excitement. This works well with Wally Wood's art but perhaps not as well in other stories. However, this detachment from the action perhaps makes the characters less compelling.

Iron Maiden herself comes from a well-established line of femme fatales in movies, pulps, radio drama and comics - she's from the line that gave us Catwoman in Batman, Valkyrie in Airboy, and a significant number of women in the Spirit. SuperScrounge comments on the unrealistic, seemingly skin-tight armour, but I think it's forgivable in the general way comics are presented. So much of what we see would not work in real life.

As with many character in all sorts of media of the time, there's been a lot of subtext read into how characters are presented, with the editorial standards of the Comics Code and the Hayes Code limiting what can actually portrayed. Later portrayals of Iron Maiden are far more Mata Hari than what was allowed at this time.

Wally Wood's skill as a comics artist and writer is properly celebrated, and his unwillingness to simply play by the rules of the Comics Code Authority seems to account for his nomadic career, looking for more freedom of expression. His influence is still seen - for example, Star Wars' stormtroopers look much like the Warlord's soldiers, with the comics version's skull-like helmet the superior version.

In this reading, I spotted an error that I've never noticed before. At one point, Len Brown is referred to as 'Thunderbolt' rather than 'Dynamo', probably telling us the original code-name for this character during development. I'm happy we weren't given the adventures of Thunderbolt and his Thunderbelt as that's a bit too cute for me.

Overall, the story is a product of its time, but a good version nevertheless. I mentioned earlier that I've enjoyed the THUNDER Agents since I was a kid, so its shortfalls aren't enough to bring it down for me.
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gregjh

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #37 on: September 15, 2024, 12:15:03 PM »

I enjoyed reading about the Kelly gang. It's got me curious to check how much of it is true. I tend to sympathise with some Wild West outlaws and that's probably naive.
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Downunder Dan

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #38 on: September 15, 2024, 12:41:12 PM »

The Kelly Gang Ride

In any telling of a story based on true events, there are choices to be made. You can follow closely what actually happened, or you can make changes to make it work better as a story. There's a bit of both going on here.

Quirky Quokka has made mention of the strange clothing and personal grooming choices in this story. The members of the Kelly Gang don't dress like they would likely have at that period, and as we can see in photos from the time, Ned and company weren't as clean shaven as shown here. (Although its worth remembering that there has been a case of a fake Ned Kelly photo, so who knows for certain how true any of them are.)

On the other hand, we have a story that meanders a bit to reflect events that might have been made a more streamlined read by combining things. We also have both Mrs Ellen Kelly and her daughter Kate play significant roles at the very start of the story, but disappearing. I have read that Ellen Kelly was still imprisoned and in the gaol where Ned has hanged, which might have been used to some effect in rounding off the story in a less abrupt way. (I checked to make sure there were no missing pages, the ending was so abrupt!)

The art is serviceable though not great - it conveys the story clearly but without too much style. Lucky Doolan, who wrote and drew the story, has not otherwise known to have worked in comics, so any deficiencies may be considered in that light.

Ned Kelly's last words were, allegedly, 'Such is life.' But it's also reported they were, 'Ah well, I suppose.' The latter version is probably more fitting for this telling of the story.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2024, 12:15:31 AM by Downunder Dan »
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Downunder Dan

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #39 on: September 16, 2024, 12:29:21 AM »

I said I made a list of Iron Outlaw stories...

FURTHER READING

Air Fighters #2 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=15314 Story: ‘Skywolf’

Cisco Kid #23 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=31664 Story: ‘The Iron Bandit’

Doll Man Quarterly #15 Story: ‘The Man in the Iron Mask’

Gangsters Can’t Win #1 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=40690 Story: ‘Wanted Ned Kelly Australia's Public Enemy #1’

Headline Comics #30 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=55526 Story: ‘Bullet-Proof Bad Man’

Monte Hale Western #58 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=26342 Story: ‘Monte Hall Battles the Human Fortress’

Redskin #7 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=34504 Story: ‘The Iron Horseman’

Six-Gun Heroes #46 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=63243 Story: ‘The Bulletproof Outlaw’

Straight Arrow #14 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=17085 Story: ‘The Bullet-Proof Badmen’

Tim Holt #32 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=36910 Story: ‘The Iron Mask’

Western Fighters #7 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=39899 Story: ‘Sheet-Iron Miller’

Western Hero #101 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=73017 Story: ‘Monte Hale and the Man in the Iron Mask’

Western Killers #64 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=33776 Story: ‘The Bullet-Proof Bandit’

Westerner #25 https://comicbookplus.com/?dlid=22712 Story: ‘Terror of the Bush – Ned Kelly (a true story)’

Of specific interest are the Air Fighters story, which features a half-man Half-machine villain; the Headline Comics story, which is by Joe Simon & Jack Kirby and features Jim Miller, an American outlaw with some Ned Kelly-like aspects; and the Monte Hale story, which has an interesting way of dealing with an armoured foe.

Thanks for your contributions!

Here's a page from Monty Wedd's epic Ned Kelly comic strip, telling the Kelly saga one page at a time over 146 weeks! (Printed in the 1970s, it's not within the ambit of this site.)

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The Australian Panther

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #40 on: September 16, 2024, 01:06:03 AM »

Dan said,
Quote
In this reading, I spotted an error that I've never noticed before. At one point, Len Brown is referred to as 'Thunderbolt' rather than 'Dynamo', probably telling us the original code-name for this character during development. I'm happy we weren't given the adventures of Thunderbolt and his Thunderbelt as that's a bit too cute for me. 


You are exactly right!
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Quirky Quokka

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Re: Reading Group #331 - Iron Outlaws
« Reply #41 on: September 16, 2024, 04:39:55 AM »


I said I made a list of Iron Outlaw stories...

FURTHER READING



Wow, that's a pretty comprehensive list, Dan. That will keep us going for a while.

It looks like that full-page Ned Kelly strip was good quality, though I'm not sure I would have stuck around for 146 weeks. Phew!

Cheers

QQ
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