[Yoc]

I've got them but haven't read beyond... #4 of the first series.
So far I'm lukewarm to the series.

[BountyHunter]

Push on, man. They get better.

I recommend the Masquerade mini-series.  Lots of Flashback stuff in that one.

[Ed Love]

Masquerade was quite good. A few little annoyances in the beginning that cast the guy heroes in an unsympathetic light, and the painterly coloring really muddies up what were strong pencils when seen online.

But, it was a REAL story that addressed the plot points raised, that allowed you to really get to know the character, her motivations, her abilities. And, it was truer to the original character by being able to pretty much ignore everything done to her until the last issue.

That character as presented in the mini was interesting. The one in P:S that can take over people's bodies, not so much.

[crimsoncrusader]

Well while I respect everyone's opinion I thought I'd give my two cents on the series :

I have enjoyed Project Superpowers chapter 1 and 2 so far as well as the 3 miniseries and the free comic book one shot and the 1/2 issue. For those of you who say that they did not research the characters you are misinformed. Ross and the rest of the creative team have researched these characters careful and have stated that the original golden age material is canon. They have chosen to use obscure characters such Green Giant and Radior in the series and have include a two page origin splash in each chapter two issue that is taken from the original material in order to inform those who do not have access to the golden age material. As far as the art goes, I love Ross's covers and the new artist for chapter two , Salazar,  is doing a great job and is an improvement from the earlier issues (though I do not mind the art in chapter one, but they did need a better colorist). Also trade paperbacks have been released for three of the series, Project Superpowers Chapter 1, Death Defying 'Devil, and Masquerade, which can be purchased for around $ 8.00 online. So as far as cost goes not very expensive if you know where to shop, heck I buy the new issues for a $1.99 from my local discount comic book store. The plot is getting pretty interesting as the story continues and with the upcoming Ghost, Continued Black Terror, and Meet the Bad guys min-series the PS universe is growing even more interesting.

[John C]

That character as presented in the mini was interesting. The one in P:S that can take over people's bodies, not so much.

This got me thinking and I realized that this seems to have always been a kind of problem when writers resurrect Golden Agers:  They add powers just for the heck of it, and it just doesn't fit.

Project: Superpowers obviously takes extra flak for it, since they did it with just about everybody.  However, that's what the JLA team did with Black Canary, way back when.  With the Star-Spangled Kid on the new JSA, they gave him Starman's Cosmic Rod.  Typically conservative Bob Rozakis overhauled the abilities of the Freedom Fighters.  Heck, even Roy Thomas gave Liberty Belle those bizarre sonic powers--that and the new costume always felt like the lowest point of the series to me.  The recent JSA books have granted powers (or extra powers) to the Hawks, the Marvels, Wildcat, Judomaster (who isn't really a Golden Ager, granted), Hourman, and Crimson Avenger at one point or another, just off the top of my head.

So, while I don't understand the obsession (especially when it's never been successful), it's definitely there, and it's spread across most of the industry.

As to the story itself, I'm glad to hear that things are (apparently) more interesting, but they lost me too early on.  In the first few issues, the plot (ignoring the thinly-veiled "patriotic people are naive" parable with the Yank) was every Marvel crossover and every Kurt Busiek story:  Some shadowy evil must be resolved via a global scavenger hunt.  In other words, a guided tour of a new universe for its own sake.  Add in the pseudo-hipster dialogue everywhere and the obsession with America being wrong-wrong-wrong about Hiroshima, and it was just too painful to continue.

If they've changed for the better, then good for them.   Unfortunately, budgetary requirements and a lingering aftertaste prevent me from giving them another chance, especially when I have so many other entertainment sources competing for my attention.

[bchat]

Anybody still reading P:SP?

I'm still reading the books [they're the only New books I currently collect], but I'm usually about two weeks behind since I don't get them the day the come-out.  I just picked-up Chapter Two # 1 this past Saturday.

I liked Masquerade up to issue four.  I felt disappointed by the last issue in the series, but the first three were fun to read.  Personally, I couldn't care less which way Masque gets handled.  With powers or without, original GA version or DE revamp, she simply doesn't interest me that much that I would pick-up another series featuring her.

Death-Defying 'Devil was a good series and I liked seeing Silver Streak & Ghost show-up.  The only complaint I could have about it was that it was a kind of a "quick read" and the art wasn't my cup of tea.  Some of the figuring-drawing, especially during the action sequences, gave me the impression that I was looking at high-end fan art.

Black Terror?  "I like it very much", I just don't think DE made a wise decision by having it tie-in so closely with the main PSP storyline.  Other than that, seeing Twister and Man of War in something other than a quick cameo appearance was cool.

[Ed Love]

I made a similar comment about the JSA on another message board, this need to give all of the non-powered heroes super-powers. Admittedly, some of it was accumulated over long periods of time, but it has since continued at an alarming rate.

With P:S, I hold it against them for a couple of reasons. The powers have little or nothing to do with the characters, it's a one-shot catch-all origin for them (the urn), it subtracts what made them unique and interesting such as The Face and Target and the Targeteers, and the changes are done badly. The Green Lama is turned into a magician character despite the fact there are magician characters available but they wanted the Green Lama and the comic needed a magician hero, so there. As the vast majority of the characters were never established or defined to begin with, their coming out of the urn changed has no real emotional tension or payoff. Unless you know the characters beforehand, you don't know what they've changed and what they haven't. It's why the Masquerade mini works, it provides that needed context, that foundation.

My chief problem is not that they didn't research the characters, just that the stories don't reflect that research and mostly are poorly constructed. Look at the way they brought back Captain Future. We see him walking down the street with two women. Now, one of the things that made him unique was there were two women in his life, his girlfriend and her aunt. These aren't them but two random bimbos. He's played up as being a complete Lothario, something not suggested in the stories at all. JMS does this in THE TWELVE quite a bit as well, he has great human interest and character bits, only they don't actually come from the characters' past or have any real connection to the original stories. The stories he tells with the characters require little to no research. I don't mind adding and fleshing out the characters, but usually each character does have some backstory and interesting facets that it can be built upon, at least for when we first see them.

The whole conceit of P:S is built on a plot hole much as THE TRANSFORMERS movie. We are asked to believe that when the Fighting Yank talks about the urn and his ghost, the other heroes are dismissive of magic, despite the presence of two who gain their powers through Far-East mysticism in the room. We are also shown a dozen other heroes they fight alongside with magical origins and abilities. We are to further accept that faced with that opposition, he doesn't choose to investigate this further with the heroes with more mystical knowledge though he obviously knows them.

The urn and its importance is the major plot point. Yet, the story doesn't really address it at all once it's broken open. The whole mystery is left for later stories. Many stories have McGuffins or long-term mysterious plots, but you have to structure/address it in some way so that it doesn't come across as an unanswered hole in the story being told. A lot of the questions raised and that are central to the Fighting Yank story center around the urn, but no one really addresses them. It makes the first mini more of a set-up and less of a story. It's the introduction of a story.

I also never understood the antagonism between his ghostly ancestor, himself and the American Spirit. They keep implying that the ghost was "using" Bruce Carter III but we are never shown how he was using him in any bad way, how his ancestor was any more at fault than Carter III or why the American Spirit entity was any more trustworthy. The theme runs through the whole book but it felt like there was a different writer involved for each character so what we are told and what we are shown are not contradictory as much as they don't apply to each other. We are told the ghost is using Carter III for his own ends and it's bad, but the scene to help prove it is that during the 1940s, he offers Carter III a way to have superpowers at no cost to make a difference in the world and Carter III is for some reason resentful of that? What makes this worse is this is ultimately the REAL story of the first mini, but it's sidetracked by everything else and in the end doesn't make any sense.

[John C]

With P:S, I hold it against them for a couple of reasons. The powers have little or nothing to do with the characters,

Well, except in the usual tangential connection to name or appearance, which has always struck me as extremely important to Alex Ross's designs.

it's a one-shot catch-all origin for them (the urn),

It's one of the things I hate most about comics in general.  At least here, though, it's "live," rather than a retroactive origin for everybody (Robinson's "stellar energy" in the Golden Age, the metagene, the Genesis Wave, and so forth).  But being "slightly less objectionable than usual" isn't exactly high praise.

My chief problem is not that they didn't research the characters, just that the stories don't reflect that research and mostly are poorly constructed. Look at the way they brought back Captain Future. We see him walking down the street with two women. Now, one of the things that made him unique was there were two women in his life, his girlfriend and her aunt. These aren't them but two random bimbos. He's played up as being a complete Lothario, something not suggested in the stories at all. JMS does this in THE TWELVE quite a bit as well, he has great human interest and character bits, only they don't actually come from the characters' past or have any real connection to the original stories. The stories he tells with the characters require little to no research. I don't mind adding and fleshing out the characters, but usually each character does have some backstory and interesting facets that it can be built upon, at least for when we first see them.

That's definitely an issue (and you suggest the same with the Green Lama aspect, as well) that I couldn't quite put my finger on at the time:  It seemed like the story was written for somebody else's characters, then hastily revised for the selected public domain heroes.  They play out the roles of these other characters, and only secondarily bring their distinctive backgrounds to the party.

Now that you mention it, looking back, I see a lot of the same kinds of fingerprints on "Watchmen."  I can see a time when the story was probably about the end of the core DCU.  And while the story bounced from there to Archie to Charlton to original pseudo-Charlton, Dr. Manhattan retains a lot of the alienated and clinical Superman and his relationship with Lois, for example.  It would've been a terrible story with the actual Charlton characters for that reason.

The whole conceit of P:S is built on a plot hole much as THE TRANSFORMERS movie. We are asked to believe that when the Fighting Yank talks about the urn and his ghost, the other heroes are dismissive of magic, despite the presence of two who gain their powers through Far-East mysticism in the room.

Yes.  To be fair, though, I suspect (given the relative historical authenticity of an urn for Pandora's Box) that an earlier draft must have involved something like Cassandra's curse preventing anybody from believing him.  But that's a terribly overused trope to begin with, and the fact that it's not in the published book makes it comparable to having the Avengers laugh at someone claiming to be a god.

The urn and its importance is the major plot point.

Really?  I assumed that was just "tour guide" stuff.  Sort of like Krypton or Uncle Ben.  You need to know it's there for the story to make sense, but should otherwise be unimportant.  That's not the case?

I also never understood the antagonism between his ghostly ancestor, himself and the American Spirit.

Definitely.  Going in, I assumed that the Spirit was actually villainous, whereas the elder Carter was merely naive, because the former seemed to merely be asserting his righteousness rather than, say, verifying anything of relevance.  Plus, there's the whole Lewis "wrapped in a flag" bit.

So maybe it's just resentment for resentment's sake, just like the Japan argument is just there for the sake of having the heroes resent one another.

[crimsoncrusader]

This is to give more support to the claim almost all of the heroes new powers do have something to due with their golden age selves or are there to make the character more unique among many similar heroes :

Face - Causes someone to see their greatest fear. Tony Trent much like Batman wore his mask to strike fear into the hearts of criminals now it does this on a much greater level.

Masquerade - Possession. Diana Adams wanted to leave her old identity as rich socialite behind and began to wear a mask to create a new identity , Miss Masque. Now she can adopt any identity she chooses with her mask the only way to return to normal. Diana now does not know who she truly is anymore with her own memories and the ones her powers give her confusing her. She is no longer just Miss Masque, but now is Masquerade.

V-Man - Emits a deadly virus. Jerry Steele basically has changed in order to make him standout amongst the numerous patriotic heroes, so the V is no longer victory.

Ghost - Ghost-like abilities. Brad Hendricks and his plane now have powers similar to his namesake.

Target and the Targeteers - Untouchable Force. Niles Reed and his sidekicks once a bulletproof team are now an invincible trinity.

Fighting Yank - Ghost with Cloak of Protection. Yank has just switched places with his ancestor.

Owl - Flight. This just makes since that a hero named the Owl can fly.

Black Owl - Black Hole in his chest. Another play on the name like V-Man as well as a way to differentiate him from the Owl.

Eagle - Flaming Body. Differentiate him from American Eagle and the other patriotic heroes.

Cat-Man -Feral Cat-like state. Cat-Man always possessed cat powers but now he believes he is a jungle cat.

Green Lama - Master of the Meta-Physical. Green Lama was able to summon the dead in at least one appearance so controlling plant life or halting his own aging is not much of a strain if the source this ability is control over life and nature.

Its a pretty complete list of the changes in powers, but it may be missing one or two.

[Ed Love]

Seems to me, some of that is stretching. Thing is, by giving every non-powered character powers, it serves to de-unique them instead of making them moreso and they aren't really driven by what made the characters interesting in the first place. The Target and Targeteers for instance: A multi-talented man is driven by the unjust death of his brother to create a bulletproof suit and using his mind and athletic skills to fight crime alongside two friends. Why does powers make the Black Owl different from the Owl? Why not the fact that the Owl serves with the police, is tough as nails and has a female love interest and partner who shares his identity vs the second Black Owl who is a single dad of the two junior heroes Yank & Doodle (the mom killed years before by a Nazi spy) and at the behest of the original Black Owl takes over that identity to secretly watch over them. A decent detective and acrobat, he's also a talented engineer and designs a flying Owl ship. If some of that is familiar, well, the owl-ship bears a striking resemblance to one belonging to a bug-themed legacy hero in the 60s who was the inspiration for...a pair of heroes based on owls, the second of whom had a flying owl-ship. There's a lot of stuff there for a creator to mine. Giving the characters is like saying Batman needs powers. It seems to me that they are using these powers in lieu of actually differentiating the characters through characterization. The best part of Masquerade was seeing Miss Masque (which doesn't equal Miss Mask) holding her own and proving her worth alongside the super-powered characters, getting by on skill and smarts.

And, it's not just Superpowers, as noted at DC lately: Wildcat had nine-lives and a feral cat son, Alan Scott Green Lantern went from using a magic ring to basically being made up of the energy, Sandman and Sand have real prophetic dreams, Liberty Belle II has regained her superspeed (which made sense when she was the legacy of her father Johnny Quick, but she became Liberty Belle after she lost her speed), Hawkman has healing powers and remembers all his past lives, his son went from having to use power armor to a ghost to being freaking Dr. Fate, Mr. Terrific is no longer just talented and good at everything to being a genius at everything with the current one also building tech devices that render him invisible to electronic devices, Judomaster cannot be touched, Stripesy now uses super-powered giant armor, the original and current Crimson Avenger has cursed guns and the newest, King Chimera, a descendent of master of disguise the King, is able to cast realistic illusions of people. Oh, and the cowboy Vigilante is a werewolf and over at the Freedom Fighters, the new Firebrand has fire powers (like Miss Masque with the mask bit, it is a bit of over-literalization of the name and thus missing meaning, guess we can blame that one on Thomas for giving us the female Firebrand with powers, but that character was supposed to be Wildfire), the new Red Bee has real insect powers. JMS has seen fit to give Hangman some kind of mystical origins but I've not read it.

Marvel meanwhile has taken Bucky from Army camp mascot to trained wet works assassin now grown up with a cybernetic arm. JMS has more or less gone the opposite way for the most part in THE TWELVE and strives to make the different characters various shades of pathetic, saddling each with drastic flaws and taking as much a sense of wonder as he can out of each although he does give the Witness a pseudo-mystical calling.

I'd just like to see stories with the actual characters as they were. I can go anywhere and read about revision copies. I'm not opposed to some retcons. After all, most of the Nedor characters were a little inconsistent with their powers, bulletproof but able to be knocked out by a blow to the head, the Black Terror had no sign of superpowers at the end of his career. Cat-Man, Kitten, Dare-devil had multiple origins. The Hood could originally fly and his career and alter-ego name changed with a loss in powers. The Green Lama had no powers, hypnotic powers and Superman-level powers depending on which company he was at. Captain Courageous and Blue Bolt suddenly seemed to have lost all their powers and operated without costumes during the ends of their careers. And, the publisher Ace was bad about not giving characters identities or origins apart from their superhero ones: Unknown Soldier, Captain Courageous, Vulcan, Magno (least Lash Lightning was given an origin though not much else). Seems there are plenty of blank spots that can be filled in and expanded upon and a lot of super-powered characters to use before having to retcon a bunch of them.

[John C]

Exactly.  What bugs me most is that all these "random" or "adult onset" powers just HAPPEN to reflect the character's codename or costume.  Some might find that amusing (Alex Ross clearly does, since it happens in every work he touches), and I can't say it's "wrong," but it's definitely not for me.

It's one thing (to use Ed's examples) to return the Jesse Quick powers to Liberty Belle, because they're her powers.  It's quite another to say that Wildcat needs to have nine lives because, well, his mask looks like a cat.  Yes, I know there's a mildly better eplanation for Wildcat in-story, but the editorial reason was obviously the name and costume association.

It's that insanely literal-minded adaptation that says that Robin's costume should look just like the bird (Ross's Red Robin costume), Aquaman should be tied to the Camelot myth because his name is Arthur and he's a king, or any of the other shockingly appropriate coincidences.

On top of that, I also don't follow the distinctiveness argument, for the same reason as Ed.  When they all have powers to rely on, then to me at least, they're all the same except for some special effects.  Differences like that all seem highly superficial, since the characters are interchangeable except for the art.

[Ed Love]

I do find it interesting that the kid heroes are treated in every way that their adult counterparts aren't: they are kept on model in appearance and actions, they are more closely extrapolated from their back stories such as Boy King's native land Swisslakia. The only thing is I don't think Captain Battle's sidekick ever went by the name of Captain Battle, Jr., that's a different character.

An issue of Clue Comics was the first GA book I ever owned and I never thought I'd see the day that I'd see a comic with Boy King and his Giant being treated straightforwardly, much less as a leader of other teen heroes. I will freely admit that as much as I love the oddball Zippo in that comic, he'd probably need a little updating to today's technology. But, the Inheritors are more along the lines of what I'd like to see.

[John C]

The Captain Battle family weirds me out for all its narrative jumps.  However, it's implied (and possibly stated in an unscanned issue) that the son joined the military because his father wouldn't let him become a sidekick, during which time he started referring to himself as Captain Battle Junior, though in Army browns rather than a costume.

It could plausibly be assumed that, after saving dear old Dad from the evil Nazi castle and getting awards for accomplishing his mission (through no fault of his own, I might add), Jon finally let him tag along after the war ended.  Presumably, Hale/Kane/Souvenir was splashed with some Dissolvo and turned into gravy like his parents.

Or are we not supposed to notice that Cap was directly responsible for the deaths of his sidekick's parents among several dozen other innocents...?

[boox909]

The Captain Battle family weirds me out for all its narrative jumps.  However, it's implied (and possibly stated in an unscanned issue) that the son joined the military because his father wouldn't let him become a sidekick, during which time he started referring to himself as Captain Battle Junior, though in Army browns rather than a costume.

I just ignore this series. It exists only to those who purchase it.

It is a fantasy originating in Earth-0!

The sooner people cease buying the books, the sooner this aberration abates.

Then again, I am a bit biased against this project...

B. 

[John C]

The sooner people cease buying the books, the sooner this aberration abates.
Then again, I am a bit biased against this project...
B. 

Actually, odd as it may sound, I was complaining about the original Captain Battle stories.  Gleason's output is usually good, but this stuff lurches back and forth like a drunken Nick Fury.  I'll try to save you some painful reading, but understand that I'm only exaggerating a tiny bit for dramatic effect.  The courageous can verify what I'm about to say by downloading the original comics.

Battle's first outing is against horrific demon hawkpeople, which he dispatches with his Dissolvo Gun, turning them into puddles of smelly, evil gravy or something.  'Cept it turns out that the demons were actually transformed humans, so Battle just murdered (chemically melted) a bunch of innocent people, including women and children.  Oopsie!

One kid survives, though, even though he can't remember who he was and there aren't any parents (in solid form, at least) to claim him.  The kid remembers Nathan Hale as his hero, though, so the Cap'n renames him Hale Battle.  Except that, soon after, he renames the kid Kane Battle (and this name is retroactively placed in reprints), messing with one of the few things he remembers.  Oh, and he nicknames the kid "Souvenir," which, if you know any French, you'll realize how highly inappropriate and insensitive that might be ("to remember").

There's other weirdness, too.  They figure out whodunit in one story, because they spot a guy with an Asian-looking face...in Chinatown, because nobody looks Asian there.  They also fall into a pit and spend pages discussing how best to get out, completely ignoring the jetpacks they wear everyplace.  And then there's a long story with a sea serpent and pirate treasure.  They got a lot of mileage out of their dartboard, in other words.

In an issue we don't have, Junior apparently steals Cap's gadgets to be a hero on his own, only to be reprimanded because it's too dangerous.  Just not for Hale/Kane/Amnesia Boy.  But you know what IS safe?  Signing up with the Air Corps when you're way the heck underage.  I mean, it's not like anybody's going to shoot at you when you drop in on the German front, right?

So Junior heads to Germany with his partner and dog to capture a Nazi general.  While there, he stumbles across his father, who he fails to release.  He also fails to capture the general, but DOES accidentally destroy the castle withh explosives.  Oh, and the dog suicides as it happens, running into the mined castle with a lit torch, because the story makes no damned sense.  Junior decides to take a vacation in France, though, where he--through no fault of his own--accidentally captures the general and frees his not-exploded-at-all father.  He and the dog (posthumously) both get medals, because clearly by this point in the war, the Air Corps was getting pretty liberal with the milestones.  I hear Carter Hall was up for a big promotion for tying his shoes correctly until that whole Justice Battalion fiasco.

In the last story I've located, he's wandering the countryside as a kid ghostbuster or some nonsensical thing like that.  When someone attacks him, though, he "rips off his clothing and is revealed as...Captain Battle Junior!"  And that's hilarious, because he's not wearing a patriotic costume--it looks like an army uniform underneath his outer clothes.

So if Dynamite messes up Captain Battle and friends, worry not, because they were a little bit on the incoherent side coming right out of the gate.

[Yoc]

Thanks for the great synopsis John! 
Where were you in H.S. when I needed someone to read The Iliad and write a report for me?

[phabox]

Hey Yoc, you shouda done the same as I used to do as a school kid, just read the 'Classics Illustrated' version and 'fake' it from there  !

-Nigel

[John C]

Clearly, I was reading comic books, Yoc.  Or watching cartoons.

But to be fair, Homer never wrote anything as off-the-wall as Captain Battle.  That was weird enough that I had to write out a summary when I was reading it, just in case of such an emergency...

[Yoc]

You kill me John!
LOL

I guess C.I. might have worked but I wanted to read the thing anyways knowing something vaguely about it... I got about 1/3 done and faked it from that.  Lucky it's fairly famous.

[darkmark]

To tell the truth, I'm not that turned on by it, either.  Pretty art and "name" heroes, but absolutely nothing, or not much, to make me give a damn about any of them.  And that's sad.

[John C]

I think I did pretty much the same thing with "Catcher in the Rye," Yoc.  I just couldn't take it anymore, after a couple of chapters, and banked on Salinger being as predictable as he seemed.  Made it through an exam and a paper.  I only wish I would've thought of that when reading "A Separate Peace."  I mean, really.  Do teenagers actually need to read about some middle aged loser's interpretation of teen angst?  (Oh, wait.  That's what sold New Teen Titans, I guess.  And that was complete with an author's proxy dating a major character, which wasn't creepy AT ALL.)

Meanwhile, I think Darkmark nailed the problem with the Dynamite books:  It's (almost) all spectacle and layout, without an emotional hook for the reader.  The reader's primary link to the universe, Fighting Yank, is bitter and derided as an idiot from all sides, so there's no reason to care about any of them.

I felt much the same way reading "Infinite Crisis."  They reintroduce Kal-L and Superboy to sympathetically voice the concerns of many older fans, then proceed to show how wrong-headed and even destructive they are--something that Kal-L pretty much actually states outright as he dies.  It makes it hard to care about anything that happens when the opposition is basically a strawman to be bashed, especially when said opposition is siding with much of the audience.

[Yoc]

Hi John,
Gee, sorry you didn't like the 80s New Teen Titans - it was the first DC series I ever faithfully bought.  Even got Mr Perez to autograph a pile of them.  He seemed nice enough and was patient as hell with my pile.

Funny thing, about a  month back I stat down to read 'Catcher in the Rye' and tossed it in the garbage about 5 chapters in.  I despised the 'hero' which I guess Salinger wanted for some screwy reason.

-Yoc

[John C]

New Teen Titans just wasn't for me.  It was the Marvel aesthetic in "DC drag," so to speak.  And if it's in the Marvel style, then there's gotta be angst.  I know I'm in the minority for not enjoying that sort of thing.  There are millions of college kids, housewives, teenagers, and un- and self-employed folks who are thoroughly addicted to daytime soap operas, after all, and the only common thread is that they're home during the day.

It also carried a lot of the Marvelisms that turn me right off, though, like names that only "work" when read, such Koriand'r and Psimon.  And speaking of Starfire, I really get turned off by what I call the "And Then Effect."  She's not just an alien, but an alien princess.  And she's a beautiful, half-naked alien princess.  Did I mention that she's a beautiful, half-naked alien WARRIOR princess...?  It's like reading about Wolverine with less facial hair and a bigger...hairdo.

The only parts that really bugged me (given the remainder of the premise, I mean) were the boring villains (I suspect I'll never understand the appeal of Deathstroke) and, as mentioned, the realization that Terry Long was standing around to act on Wolfman's Wonder Girl fantasies.  I suppose there's nothing wrong with that, except to the extent that a grown man basically writing fiction about his relationship with an imaginary teenage girl is uncomfortable in public.

And hey, I liked the New Guardians, near-obscene stereotyping, incoherent storylines, and all, so who am I to judge?

[Yoc]

Each to their own John.  I haven't gone back to try re-reading them.  Who knows how I'd feel about them now. 
We all collect stuff that might be hard to explain to someone else without just pushing a pile of comics in their lap.

At the time I was following Perez from Marvel to DC.  I loved his work on Avengers.  I never did understand why Donna would be interested in such a boring guy as Long.
From TT I moved on to Byrne X-men to The Elementals - Megaton Man/Boarder Wars - b&w indies like Dalgoda, Ralph Snart, Roachmill and The Tick and the last monthly book I ever collected was Peter Bagge's 'Hate' in 1990.

-Yoc

[narfstar]

I still stick with JLA and JSA out of a loyalty that does not depend on the quality. I will often not hate something others might about them just because they are who they are. That may be a common thing with how many people react to their childhood friends.