[Roygbiv666]

Is there a somewhat decent on-line resource that would be able to provide at least "relative" rarity/scarity of various issues?

This dimly relates to my trying to put together a "Grim Reaper" Collection. I get the sense that "Fighting Yank" #7, "Wonder Comics" #2, and a few others are not likely to appear on GAC anytime soon, as they seem quite rare.

[cimmerian32]

Cost has as much to do with it as anything...  even in craptacular grade, those ain't cheap issues (which is related to, but not limited to, scarcity)...  But, they're on my list!

Cimm

[bchat]

I asked a similar question a while back.  I've searched the internet as thoroughly as I ever will and came-up empty-handed.  The best I was able to find was a site that listed what the Gerber Scarcity Index meant, but nothing that listed the index comic-by-comic.

(for anyone who cares, this is what I found)
The Gerber Scarcity Index:
11 (non-existent but known to have been printed).
10 (less than 5 copies known to exist).
9 (very rare - 6-10 copies known to exist).
8 (rare - only 11 to 20 copies believed to exist).
7 (scarce - only 21 to 50 copies believed to exist).
6 (uncommon - 51 to 200 copies believed to exist). 
5 (less than average - 200 to 1,000 copies believed to exist).
4 (average - 1,000-2,000 existing copies).
3 (more than average - example: 70's books).
2 (common - example: 80's books).
1 (very common/new comics).

[John C]

And of possible interest is that even those ratings or categories are really only as accurate in terms of what's in circulation, except for key cases where the entire print run is known.

As an example of where Gerber is probably wrong, that issue of Tops Comics with the Jack of Spades?  Three of us picked up the issue at around the same time with the intent of scanning it.  I believe mine (in pretty darn good condition, though I don't know what a dealer would call it) cost ten bucks.

If there's fewer than twenty, then that's a huge coincidence.

[narfstar]

I did not pay much for mine either

[kquattro]

Is there a somewhat decent on-line resource that would be able to provide at least "relative" rarity/scarity of various issues?

Scarcity and or rarity regarding comic books is:

1) All relative
2) Impossible to determine accurately

If a comic is desirable to collectors--i.e. has an origin, a first appearance, a hot artist--then the demand may outweigh the supply. Does that make it scarce? It is if you want it and can't find it. I've routinely bought items (particularly since the advent of eBay) that I've sought for years and I would consider rare and usually below Overstreet prices. But a lot of other collectors aren't looking for the same things that I am. A good example were the issues of WAGS (the Aussie/British Golden Age tabloid) I picked up in recent years. I spent almost 30 years looking for a copy (ANY issue) and I've won 3 on eBay at prices that I consider a steal. Again, scarcity is relative.

Secondly, I laugh when I see "census" figures for comics that say "X amount of copies exist". How could anyone possibly know? Unless a comic had a known low print run (such as SHOCK ILLUSTRATED #3), then it's just a guess as to how many copies still exist. And these guesses are simply ridiculous. "Less than 10 copies exist"...really? Unless someone is omniscient or has looked in every box, in every attic or talked to everyone, than all they are doing is guessing.

--Ken Q

[OtherEric]

I think the Gerber numbers are useful for RELATIVE scarcity about 90% of the time.  That doesn't mean I think their total numbers are right, just that about 90% of the time a higher number will be rarer than a lower number.  And sometimes flukes occur, or there are warehouse finds, or whatever.

One possible source of 'rarity' info is heritage auction archives.  While their numbers will be skewed based on the popularity and condition of the book, you can at least see how many times they had a book for sale in the past 7 years.  I think there are a few other auction record sites but they're pay and limit what you can see for free.

Right now, I suspect the rarest books on GAC are the Peter Wheat News issues I've posted; just because until I posted them there were NO documented issues past 36.  In the past several months I've found one issue and got somebody else to provided scans for another, but I cannot find any reference to specific other issues anywhere.  Those I believe may be true Gerber 10's, or even some issues sadly 11's.

[Roygbiv666]

Thanks everyone. I did run across that comic grading thing, CGC, and they list how many of each grade of each issue they've graded.

Theoretically, if there are like 124 copies of #9, 143 copies of #10, and 4 of #11, one might conclude (statistically) that #11 is at least "more rare" than 9,10. Maybe.

[JVJ]

I asked a similar question a while back.  I've searched the internet as thoroughly as I ever will and came-up empty-handed.  The best I was able to find was a site that listed what the Gerber Scarcity Index meant, but nothing that listed the index comic-by-comic.

(for anyone who cares, this is what I found)
The Gerber Scarcity Index:
11 (non-existent but known to have been printed).
10 (less than 5 copies known to exist).
9 (very rare - 6-10 copies known to exist).
8 (rare - only 11 to 20 copies believed to exist).
7 (scarce - only 21 to 50 copies believed to exist).
6 (uncommon - 51 to 200 copies believed to exist). 
5 (less than average - 200 to 1,000 copies believed to exist).
4 (average - 1,000-2,000 existing copies).
3 (more than average - example: 70's books).
2 (common - example: 80's books).
1 (very common/new comics).

The data/ranking for each issue is in the Gerber Photo Guide books. Your local library should have copies if you don't have a local friend with them.

Peace, Jim (|:{>

ps. did you see that a copy of a common (80's book) comic, Wolverine #1, CGC'd at 10.0, sold for $10,000 at Heritage BEFORE the buyer's premium of 19.5%? Rarity isn't the only factor, I suppose.

[narfstar]

The rarity is a perfect 10 book. I find it hard to believe in perfection. Was the book slapped right out of the printer.

[Roygbiv666]

The rarity is a perfect 10 book. I find it hard to believe in perfection. Was the book slapped right out of the printer.

Slapped, like a newborn babe? Seems odd to me. 

[JVJ]

The rarity is a perfect 10 book. I find it hard to believe in perfection. Was the book slapped right out of the printer.

I don't believe it's rare, narf.
That was at the heyday of the direct market "collectibles" boom and with Wolverine and a Frank Miller cover, there must have been hordes of speculators. The print run must have been at least 300,000 copies and a lot of them were surely put away right out of the direct market shipments. If only 1/100 of 1% of the print run turns out to be a GCD 10 (and this is a book that was surely speculated on and babied by speculators), that means that there are 30 copies of that "perfect" 10 out there. Even Gerber only calls that "Scarce."

I'm willing to bet that there are a lot more than 30, too. Just nobody bothered to spend the money to get it slabbed. Now they will.

Scratching my beard...

(|:{>

[kozmo]

at least one of the online vendors (Tales of Wonder - I've had good luck doing business with them) has the first volume of the Gerber for only $9.99
http://talesofwonder.com/product-exec/product_id/39390/sc/5,145/pn/Photo-Journal+Guide+To+Comics+Vol+1+-+SALE  - no excuses now - I bought all four volumes at full price when they came out and have NEVER questioned that purchase.

but to Gerber's defense, and I think this has been posted before but is worth repeating, these were published pre-internet/eBay.  The journals themselves make it clear that the scarcity rating is based on personal observation of decades of working with the top retailers in the field.  If it never came up for sale, it would be seen as more scarce. We definitely have a better sense today of scarcity, but it's not fair to condemn Gerber for using what was available at the time.

[bchat]

but to Gerber's defense, and I think this has been posted before but is worth repeating, these were published pre-internet/eBay.  The journals themselves make it clear that the scarcity rating is based on personal observation of decades of working with the top retailers in the field.  If it never came up for sale, it would be seen as more scarce. We definitely have a better sense today of scarcity, but it's not fair to condemn Gerber for using what was available at the time.

I wouldn't condemn Gerber for the effort.  It's a massive undertaking no matter what time period it was completed in.

[kquattro]

We definitely have a better sense today of scarcity, but it's not fair to condemn Gerber for using what was available at the time.

I'm not condemning Ernie Gerber at all. My whole point is that the concept of comic book scarcity is a relative matter and in most cases, impossible to determine accurately. The perceived desirability of a comic (based on content) may well make it appear scarce since the demand outstrips the availability. But is it actually scarce? Who knows?

Common sense would seem to dictate that virtually any pre-WWII comic could fall into the scarce category. Comics were definitely considered a disposable item (as they would be for many years) and most that survived their initial disposal, would likely have been subject to the paper drives of WWII. Yet, if the comic isn't an early issue of a superhero, it likely isn't considered scarce. Why? Because not as many collectors are looking for it.

For years, editions of Overstreet used to carry a notation at the end of the MASK COMICS listing that read: "NOTE: no. 2 sold over 1,000,000 copies on the stands.". But if you look at the entry directly above this note, you would find (and still do) that MASK COMICS #2 is considered scarce. Why? If it sold over one million copies, you mean to tell me that only "21 to 50 copies" are believed to exist? Could it have something to do with the fact that it has a "classic" L.B. Cole cover and collectors were suddenly looking for it after the push Cole got from Overstreet circa 1981?

Perception and reality are two very different things.

--Ken Q