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Professor H's Wayback Machine

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topic icon Author Topic: Professor H's Wayback Machine  (Read 162941 times)

profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #150 on: August 03, 2013, 02:46:07 AM »

And now we get to some really obscure stuff...  Just added to my Professor H Revisits The Bible blog... the story of "REHOBOAM and JEROBOAM".

http://professorhrevisitsthebible.blogspot.com/2013/08/rehoboam-and-jeroboam.html

This one was done 4 times, with art by Irv Novick, Curt Swan (??), and Frank Bolle (twice!).

What follows is even less well-known...!
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jimmm kelly

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #151 on: August 04, 2013, 12:10:59 AM »


I am that way with most artists. How can people identify them


I seem to have an eye for comic art. Maybe this is because I shunned Marvel Comics (which gave credits) and mainly read other publishers like DC that didn't give credits (not consistently)--when I first started reading comics. So I quickly learned to identify the artists that I liked--even if I didn't know their names.

On an old message board, Rich Morrissey told me that he used ears to identify inkers. It makes sense--while an inker might have to adjust his style, depending on the penciller, he's probably going to ink ears his own way no matter whose pencils he's working on. Now that might evolve over time, but if you have a page that you know was inked by Joe Giella in '63 and you have another page from '63 where you don't know the inker, you can see if the ears in both look the same--and then it's probably Giella. I've always noticed the weirdness of comic book ears. It confounded me as a kid, because the whirls in those ears don't look like anything in real life.

Still on the business of inkers and just for identifying Old Look Batman inkers, you look at the bat on the chest. Each inker had his own way of doing the bat, so you should be able to distinguish a Charles Paris ink job from a Sheldon Moldoff. I think Bob Hughes gave me this tip--also on an old message board.

This rule of thumb probably applies to other characters who have chest emblems (or back emblems in the case of Spider-Man and Superman).

Sid Greene, my favourite inker, has an unmistakable style. When he pencils a comic, he always tries to put Julius Schwartz somewhere in the scene. He didn't do this when he inked someone else's pencils, because he didn't think it was proper.

Other pencillers have their own idiosyncracies. I can spot a Carmine Infantino pencilling job from a mile away, because he has his own way of posing figures. Other artists are harder to spot, but if you study the work of a penciller for awhile, you get to know his favourite poses and those are a giveaway.

Unless, some other artist is swiping his style. That happens. In Captain Marvel Jr. adventures, the other Binder artists would swipe Mac Raboy poses. But these stick out like a sore thumb. In Raboy's own work, the poses were organic to the story, but in a non-Raboy story, Junior is striking this pose for no other reason than the artist wants to do a swipe. I think some weren't even swipes--I believe they would cut out Raboy figures and paste them on the page.

Anyway, even if you don't have an eye for art, just through sheer hard work it should be possible to make a good guess at artists, if you have a small number of suspects. Simply by tell-tale features in the art it should be possible to rule-out or rule-in the artists on your suspect list.

Lately my eyes haven't been up to this challenge. They quickly get tired, especially if I'm staring at a computer screen for more than a few minutes. Otherwise I would probably do some more detective work, but I've had to cut down on my computer time to save my eyes.
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narfstar

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #152 on: August 04, 2013, 12:33:52 AM »

Thanks for the tips. JVJ would tend to disagree but in terms of what works for him. He has said he more or less can feel/see the artist not so much a distinctive feature. I have seen some say that they recognize Alascia inks by the hands. I am not a very good art spotter and do not even try inks. I have a few artists I can spot but not a lot. Any that you have recognized that are not on GCD or need a note please do.
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jimmm kelly

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #153 on: August 04, 2013, 01:35:30 AM »

I also feel artists by instinct. In my younger days, I always identified artists by my gut. But, that came from familiarity, too. I have a better sense for DC artists than Marvel artists. Still, I think my senses are really unconsciously seeing all those identifying details. If I really think about it, I realize that there are certain earmarks I'm seeing in the art. And using a more scientific method can help you catch wrong assumptions.

I always assumed that I could easily distinguish between an Anderson and a Giella ink job. But then some years ago, checking my assumptions, I realized I was wrongly identifying some Giella jobs as Anderson--once I compared details like ears, I realized these were Giella. I think the GCD had made the same mistake and around that time the credits were corrected. Now that the GCD has Julius Schwartz's payment records, they can verify what artists should get credit for those jobs (with some qualification).
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #154 on: August 04, 2013, 01:46:22 AM »

And now, some EVEN MORE obscure stuff...  Just added to the Professor H Revisits The Bible blog...

Asa, Jehosaphat, Jehoram and Joash

http://professorhrevisitsthebible.blogspot.com/2013/08/asa-jehosaphat-jehoram-and-joash.html

That's a mouthful!  Each of these stories were covered exactly ONCE in the entire BOYS' LIFE series... from December 2007 to March 2008.  That's right-- it took over 54 YEARS before anyone tackled them!

If you like stories of intrigue and political corruption, THESE are the stories for you!
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #155 on: August 04, 2013, 01:59:26 AM »

Fascinating stuff, Jimmm.  I never picked up the "ear" thing as a habit, though I do find faces are usually a big thing, as well as poses.

I remember ages back thinking the 3-part CAP vs. the Red Skull story (reprinted in AVENGERS ANNUAL #3) didn't look consistent, though it said "Kirby & Giacoia" on all 3 parts.  Then a few years ago, ALTER EGO had an interview with Joe Giella, who revealed he'd helped his friend Frank Giacoia on many jobs... always uncredited.  WHOA!  When I did my re-reading of all my 60's Marvels, and got to the period when Giacoia started working for them, it was a real eye-opener.  I began to SEE so clearly which pages-- or parts of pages-- each of those 2 guys had done.  It was so glaringly obvious, once I knew, because unlike Wally Wood assistants or Vince Colletta assistants, Giacoia & Giella's styles don't look anything alike!!!

There's actually a SUB-MARINER issue in the early 70's where the inks are credited to Giacoia, but the book splits into 2 halves, which look NOTHING alike.

I also realized that the 1st CAP issue I ever bought with Sal Buscema-- #159 ("Turning Point"), though credited to John Verpoorten, had actually had its entire first HALF inked by JOE SINNOTT-- uncredited!  (No wonder my 1st impression of Sal was so damn good!  It was downhill all the way after that...)


I've never seen anyone who could pick out artists like Nick Caputo.  Although, there's been a few times where I've disagreed with him... and once in awhile, I got a kick when he agreed with me.  So I guess I'm not that bad at it, either...
« Last Edit: August 04, 2013, 02:03:30 AM by profh0011 »
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jimmm kelly

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #156 on: August 04, 2013, 04:00:58 AM »

Yes, I've read a few articles about Frank Giacoia and his deadline woes. Giella would be one guy who helped him out. Mike Sekowsky another. And a few others. Giacoia was probably a really nice guy, because his friends were always helping him.

I believe that he grew up with Carmine Infantino. In a few interviews, Sheldon Mayer told a story about two young guys who came to see him in his office (when he was an executive at DC/All-American), he looked at their work and told them they were good, but they should work on their art a bit before going into the business. He believed they needed time to work on their skills. One of those guys was Carmine Infantino--who took Mayer's advice and worked on improving his skills before breaking into comics. Mayer didn't identify the other guy, but he said this guy didnt' take his advice, went to work right away and never really fulfilled his potential as an artist, though he did all right as an inker. I think this was Frank Giacoia.

The habit of some other artists pitching in on work, though they weren't being paid (over the table) for it, makes me think that some of Julie Schwartz's payment records don't tell the whole story all the time.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #157 on: August 04, 2013, 06:52:56 PM »

Arnold Drake told how he wrote the first 2 DEADMAN stories but only got credited & paid for the first.  (His editor managed to have him kicked off the brand-new title Drake had just created, so HE could write it instead.) Drake was later credited & paid for reprints on the 2nd chapter.

Meanwhile, I came to the conclusion that Arnold had NOT written the last 2 issues of CAPTAIN MAR-VELL he was credited for (except for the first 4 pages of the first one).  The writing style was completely different-- not to mention, the direction of the story abruptly changed, and the entire book looked like it had been done over a weekend (including writing and full artwork!).  Arnold told me he checked his records, and he had been paid for at least the 2nd of those... but the more I thought about it, the more I thought, that doesn't necessarily mean that what he turned in and was paid for was what got published.  Which also makes me strongly suspect there may be an entire issue of Don Heck pencils that never saw the light of day. Gary Friedrich got credited with 3 issues, but the 2 before those were CONSISTENT in style & content to the ones he had his name on.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #158 on: August 05, 2013, 02:41:43 PM »

The latest restoration... this one took DAYS to clean up!

A-1 #22  /  DICK POWELL -- ADVENTURER!  (1949)

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-oVhWx8E93Zo/Uf-5GBFix5I/AAAAAAAAOCM/mKHCWgmRrF0/s1600/A-1+022_cc_CBP_HK.jpg

I dug out my copy of MURDER MY SWEET sometime in the middle of the job...   :)
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #159 on: August 06, 2013, 01:02:00 AM »

Just added to the Professor H Revisits The Bible blog...  ELIJAH (6 versions) and ELISHA (4 versions) !

http://professorhrevisitsthebible.blogspot.com/2013/08/elijah.html

http://professorhrevisitsthebible.blogspot.com/2013/08/elisha.html

Once again, these feature art by Creig Flessel, Irv Novick, Curt Swan, Frank Bolle & Anthony Castrillo.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #160 on: August 06, 2013, 02:22:02 AM »

Here's a story I bet everybody knows... just added to the Professor H Revisits The Bible blog...  "JONAH"!

http://professorhrevisitsthebible.blogspot.com/2013/08/jonah.html

This was done in BOYS' LIFE 5 times, with art by Irv Novick, Curt Swan, Frank Bolle & Anthony Castrillo.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #161 on: August 07, 2013, 03:05:53 AM »

It's amazing what you can find online. I've become aware of a large and growing number of illustrated or comics-style BIBLE series done over the years, some even quite recently. I suppose it might be called a "niche" market, but I suspect it's a huge one.


One series that goes wayyyyyyy back was done in the 1940's by EC Comics-- the same people who later became notorious for WEIRD SCIENCE-FANTASY and TALES FROM THE CRYPT-- also, MAD. This series has apparently been reprinted in hardbound.


Also, I was reminded that in the 1970's, there actually was an animated cartoon TV series entitled STORIES FROM THE BIBLE. I wonder if BOYS' LIFE changed theirs to simply BIBLE STORIES in the mid-70's to avoid confusion?


I had 2 other comics-style versions over the years. The first was a large harbound "illustrated" BIBLE, all B&W artwork. I've been looking for it lately, but can't be sure if someone around here might have given it away over the years. (You wanna save something, that'll be the thing your parents wanna get rid of, for no real reason.)


More recently, there was a digest-sized hardbound book-- but about 2 INCHES thick-- collecting the entire series illustrated by artist Andre LeBlanc (in color). I recently found out this was originally serialized in a monthly magazine (like BOYS' LIFE, but with more of a religious focus). I know this is one of many currently available online, at Amazon.com and other places. I've got it, and enjoyed it. It got me wondering why the BOYS' LIFE series kept jumping around so chaotically, instead of just starting at the beginning and working straight through without skipping things.


I've been going really hard on this today-- and just got all the way to the end of the Old Testament set up at the blog! Only 3 more sections left to set up. BOYS' LIFE did very little concerning Jesus in the last 61 years.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #162 on: August 07, 2013, 04:02:37 AM »

Busy day today... just added to the Professor H Revisits The Bible blog...

Isaiah and Hezekiah
Josiah
Daniel
Ezra
Esther
Nehemiah
The Maccabees


...and that finishes out The Old Testament!!!

Unlike the way BOYS' LIFE actually published the series, I've managed to re-present all the stories in the correct chronological sequence, which makes it much easier to put each story in the proper historical perspective.

I'm only going to post the 1st link here... if you go to the blog, each story is linked in sequence so you can go from one to the next quite easily.

http://professorhrevisitsthebible.blogspot.com/2013/08/isaiah-and-hezekiah.html
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #163 on: August 07, 2013, 01:52:35 PM »

Alright!  I just polished off the Professor H Revisits The Bible blog, the first one I've done that had a definite "end point" in mind.

The Nativity
The Parables Of Jesus
Easter


http://professorhrevisitsthebible.blogspot.com/2013/08/the-nativity.html

I feel real proud of this.  BOYS'  LIFE did not publish many of the stories in any sensible, chronological fashion, but I've managed to do just that.

Now I can move on to whatever the next project will be.
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jimmm kelly

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #164 on: August 07, 2013, 11:16:10 PM »





One series that goes wayyyyyyy back was done in the 1940's by EC Comics-- the same people who later became notorious for WEIRD SCIENCE-FANTASY and TALES FROM THE CRYPT-- also, MAD. This series has apparently been reprinted in hardbound.





I imagine that you know before M.C. Gaines published PICTURE STORIES FROM THE BIBLE at Educational Comics Inc. (EC), he published PICTURE STORIES FROM THE BIBLE at All-American Comics Inc. I've never seen the inside pages for those comics and I wonder to what extent the AC version and the EC version were the same or different. Was Gaines able to take everything with him after he sold All-American to DC--and did he just simply do a new printing of those comics, using the old pages?

It also opens up a larger question of ownership. Presumably Gaines sold his rights to All-American and all its properties to DC--yet if he was able to take PICTURE STORIES with him, there must have been some special provision for that. Did he retain ownership of other All-American properties--such as MOVIE COMICS? And would DC be able to reprint the All-American version of PICTURE STORIES FROM THE BIBLE?
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #165 on: August 09, 2013, 08:49:12 PM »

I was reading the Wikipedia article about EC Comics the other day.  If memory serves, when Gaines sold AA to DC (after earlier splitting off from them), he kept PICTURE STORIES FROM THE BIBLE.

It appears there are 2 hardbound volumes available from Amazon Marketplace stores (some at fantastic bargain prices), one for Old, for for New Testament.

I was telling someone earlier today how after DC bought out AA, they treated the AA heroes as 2nd-class citizens.  When sales plumetted, DC kept Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, and even 2 back-up strips, Aquaman and Green Arrow going.  All the "JSA" characters (Flash, Green Lantern, Hawkman, Atom) got canned.  Later, because of this, when the characters were revived, it was in "all new" versions.  Right up to the mid-90's, the original AA characters were still being treated like 2nd-class citizens. I don't think this really changed until the sucess of "JSA", which itself came after SANDMAN MYSTERY THEATRE, STARMAN (James Robinson) and THE SPECTRE (John Ostrander).

Of course, these days, I think ALL DC characters are being treated badly by DC...
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jimmm kelly

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #166 on: August 09, 2013, 10:40:00 PM »

When I was putting together my list of comics that came out this month, for my blog, I saw that the first issue of PICTURE STORIES FROM THE BIBLE, from AA, came out on August 28 '42. So it was fresh in my mind.

I know that Gaines put out two trade paperback volumes from AA, one collecting the Old Testament and the other collecting the New Testament. So I wonder if those have the same content as the hardbound volumes you say are at Amazon Marketplace.

I share your thoughts about how the All-American characters were treated after it was absorbed into DC. Even Wonder Woman, though she faired better than the others, has suffered in part because of that (I think). She became marginalized and while her main book survived, she lost SENSATION COMICS. Which would be equivalent to Superman losing ACTION COMICS or Batman losing DETECTIVE COMICS.

And converting ALL STAR COMICS to ALL STAR WESTERN would be like converting WORLD'S FINEST COMICS to WORLD'S FINEST WAR STORIES.

Consider that if just SENSATION and ALL STAR had been kept alive--even if all the other AA books had been shuttered--that would have been two books where AA characters could continue to exist. Just like the second banana DC characters that survived in ADVENTURE COMICS, ACTION COMICS, DETECTIVE COMICS and WORLD'S FINEST COMICS.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #167 on: August 10, 2013, 12:37:30 AM »

Interesting observation.  I wouldn't have even been aware of SENSATION if it wasn't for the WW ARCHIVES (I got the first 3). For once, DC did it right-- including the anthology episodes AND the solo book episodes together, chronologically.  I sure wish they'd done that with Superman and Batman.  I sure wish Marvel would have done that with Sub-Mariner!!!

As I understand it, SENSATION was a book that focused exclusively on female heroes.  Still, they could have changed the format.  I also imagine now, what if they'd stopped doing the JSA and changed ALL-STAR back to its original format-- an anthology?

The reference to ACTION, DETECTIVE and SENSATION reminds me that for Magazine Enterprises, GHOST RIDER's "regular" book was TIM HOLT!  GR began and ended there.  The GHOST RIDER comic-book (part of the rotating A-1 anthology, their equivalent of Dell's FOUR COLOR) was the "quarterly solo book".  By comparison, I guess BEST OF THE WEST was sort of like WORLD'S FINEST.

And in a completely unrelated bit (sort of), a friend sent me a 1955 issue of FOUR COLOR the other week.  Wow.  Immediately became one of the oldest comics in my collection.  The cover is in such terrible condition, it's UN-RESTORABLE (and for ME to say that, you KNOW it has to be BAAAAAAD!)  ...but, no prob.  I found a GREAT scan at Heritage Auction. The insides were perfectly readable (and scannable).

I have not done this at my blog (before, or yet), but I am considering the possibility of posting the entire story online.  But I worry I might want to keep it low-profile... since the copyright owners are notoriously (almost insanely) litigious.  (heh heh heh)
« Last Edit: August 10, 2013, 12:40:20 AM by profh0011 »
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jimmm kelly

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #168 on: August 10, 2013, 01:27:04 AM »

Toward the end of its run, SENSATION morphed into featuring adventure women and then became a romance book, with a textpage where WW had a lovelorn column, before dropping WW and morphng into SENSATION MYSTERY, which only lasted for another year or so. But SENSATION began as a super-hero/adventure comic with WW as its head-liner. Famous Sensation features were Wildcat, Sargon the Sorceror, Mr. Terrific, the Black Pirate, Little Boy Blue, The Whip. It also had short-lived features that tied in with PICTURE STORIES FROM THE BIBLE--these were Picture Stories from Mythology and Picture Stories from History. There was also a feature close to the end times called Wonder Women of History.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #169 on: August 10, 2013, 07:37:31 PM »

Just got the 2nd page of the BATMAN story set up!  2/3rds down...

http://professorhswaybackmachine.blogspot.com/2013/07/batman-1966-pt2.html
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jimmm kelly

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #170 on: August 10, 2013, 08:10:53 PM »

When I look at these, I always look to see if there's something to confirm that it is indeed Moldoff--as sources say--and not Giella as Joe's memory seems to indicate. After all, it's possible that Joe took over in the middle of a continuity and simply tried to match the style. Both Moldoff and Giella were good at aping other artists' styles. But looking at the strip for 6-25-66, I'm pretty convinced this has to be Moldoff. The second panel especially, showing the crook in close-up, is Moldoff. Only Moldoff, in his Bob Kane ghost style, would have drawn that crook that way. My gut tells me it's Moldoff.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #171 on: August 10, 2013, 10:27:24 PM »

I find it's usually the faces or figure-work that tells me who did what, unless sometimes it's the line-rendering (that was the case with George Evans). I recall last year while doing SPACE CONQUERORS!, I figured out that Lou Fine took over at the point where the linework was thre same, but, the figure-work suddenly changed. I never would have known Fine worked on it, except several different sources said he did. I wound up figuring, if I knew it was Evans, or McWilliams, or Morrow, it was.  If I COULDN'T tell-- it was Fine! I also read how he was about the only guy at Johnstone & Cushing (later Al Stenzel Prod.) who hid his own style under "generic J&C house style". So if it didn't look like anyone in particular-- it was him!  (Although, there are strips where I recognize his work, either in faces, or figure-work. There's a shot of Abraham & Isaac where Isaac's figure just screams "Lou Fine!")

I recall when this story was in the papers, one of the man things I found strange was, WHY were Catwoman's henchmen dressed like "normal" gangsters, instead of the "cat" outfits on the TV show with the cat-ear hats?
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jimmm kelly

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #172 on: August 10, 2013, 11:21:23 PM »

The strip is a weird mixed bag. You have elements of Old Look Batman in the Bob Kane style. Elements of the TV show. And elements of the New Look comic book.

The henchmen in plain clothes is a throwback to the Old Look (and still prevalent in most New Look stories by Moldoff).

The curious thing about that 6-25-66 strip with the henchman, is that you see Moldoff doing a bit of a swipe of New Look Infantino Batman in profile in the final panel. Other Batman profiles are the typical Bob Kane style profile.

So this mixture of different styles and poses is a bit of a stew.
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #173 on: August 10, 2013, 11:50:06 PM »

Twice in 3 weeks, they ran one of the strips out of sequence. The first time, the dates were correct, but they ran a Monday strip on Wednesday. Without realizing what happened, I glued it into my scrapbook in that order.  But I fixed it on the blog.  the 2nd time, the dates were wrong! Did they come that way from the syndicate, or did the local paper scribble in the dates? At any rate, the 2nd time, I caught it and pasted it down the right way, which is also how I posted it online (but with a note).

In one, they're showing off the death traps. The next day, one of the crooks says, "Wait'll you see 'em, C.W.!" 

Late n the 2nd season of the show, 2 Catwoman stories that actually had continuity between them were run in the wrong order-- and CONTINUE to be run n the wrong order in syndication, to this day!  But because the show was on when I was on the road when I taped it (around 1991), I had to copy-edit every single episode to get rid of the commercials.  I fixed several screw-ups like this while I was at it, compiling the "edited" tapes in the correct order. 

They'd also started with a Joker marathon on a Sunday, then skipped all those stories when they should have run them later.  AAARGH!  While I was ait it, I actually taped the feature film IN BETWEEN seasons 1 and 2, so if you just run the tapes, you can watch it IN SEQUENCE.  Of course, Catwoman's continuity doesn't seem to make sense if you do that... UNLESS you just accept that Juie Newmar and Lee Meriweather were playing two DIFFERENT villains, both calling themselves "Catwoman".  Hey, it happened in the comics al the time, right?
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profh0011

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Re: Professor H's Wayback Machine
« Reply #174 on: August 18, 2013, 04:03:36 PM »

The latest restoration...

FANTASTIC FOUR #12  /  Mar'63
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-KfErSexLBDM/UhDs-CZYDiI/AAAAAAAAOnQ/aqicful23WE/s1600/FF+012_cc_BP_HK.jpg

This took a few hours.  I didn't want the edge of the price tag cut off, so I had to fill in some detail down the left edge.  But more, I didn't want the Comics Code stamp almost cut IN HALF, so I had to go to Heritage Auction and skim thru at least 7 different scans before I could find one that had enough detail down the RIGHT egde so I could use it as a guide to RECONSTRUCT the entire right edge on the BIG scan I did have, courtesy of Barry Pearl.

In addition to all that, I also had to crank up the color on the Hulk, his tights, the FF's costumes, any green lettering, and drastically adjust the skin tones (which were WAY too "pink" on the actual scan).  Plus the usual elimination of dirt, color drop-outs, some coloring mistakes, and filling in black areas.

MUCH nicer!  I've been wanting to do this one for years now.
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